As it happened here:
http://armorgames.com/community/thread/12479175/locked-moegreche-must-be-tired-of-this-thread/page/1
We learn 1) armorgames allows its moderators to ban users w/o reason 2) armorgames does not allow users to contest bans
3) armorgames does not allow users to present problems with moderators 4) armorgames decide moderation-issues w/o even looking at the case 5) armorgames allows the accused moderators to moderate their own case, what is unaccaptable in any system 6) armorgames flat out lies here: "You chose to start and maintain a discussion with a religious topic that had absolutely nothing to do with the game in question. "
- as the thread was not a game's thread, but a general thread
- it wasn't I who started the thread
7) armorgames flat out lies at this: "All participants in this discussion were warned. All of them."
- as only my posts were removed, and on top of it I was banned, while the other side (Moegreche) suffered no action, this is nothing but flat out injustice.
8) armorgames flat out lies again with this: "One of the images you linked to was me doing just that."
- when the "apology" contains threat of more banning, direct accusation and such, it is not an apology.
This is an example of Ferret's "apologies", and "investigation of cases":
"Moegreche has long been a Mod here at Armor Games, and is most upstanding of character. I'll let him respond to this if he wants to, but as far as I'm concerned the Armor Games admins support his ruling in this matter.
If this thread derails itself into harassing/bashing a Moderator, I will personally obliterate your account. "
So as Moegreche "has been ... most upstanding of character" there is no need to even look at the case rised. Ye, like it works that way. Upstanding President Nixon, eh?
"has long been a Mod here at Armor Games, and is most upstanding of character. I'll let him respond to this if he wants to, but as far as I'm concerned the Armor Games admins support his ruling in this matter.
"If this thread derails itself into harassing/bashing a Moderator, I will personally obliterate your account. " - what else is this other than threatening without even looking at the case? 9) armorgames allows moderators to TROLL USERS.
The thread was renamed to "Moegreche MUST BE TIRED", what is nothing else but trolling&flaming. And you figured out, it was top-moderator Ferret.
I have nothing else to say. The case is obvious. Armorgames has very serious problems with its moderators, moderations, breaking its own terms&conditions, and in general public handling.
Any post in this thread should be giving me contact-adress of Ferret's superiors. Anything else should be considered off-topic, or even more serious.
Sorry, I'm not trying to argue with you or anything, but I just want to point out some things:
MrDayCee had pointed out he banned you for game comments, it was not thread related. Moegreche had nothing to do with your ban.
Armor Games does allow you to contest your ban, and there are reasons why people get banned.
Also, "they" did not lie. They pointed out to you everything and reasoned with you.
They did not break the terms and conditions either, and they have been very reasonable about this. Also, Ferret is the superior, he's an admin. Part of the AG team.
I know you are asking for contact details about superiors, but Ferret is probably as high as it gets for communications.
I'm not accusing you of anything here okay? I'm just pointing things out.
1) armorgames allows its moderators to ban users w/o reason
There were perfectly good reasons to ban you.
2) armorgames does not allow users to contest bans
It does, but your ban was legitimate, so was upheld.
3) armorgames does not allow users to present problems with moderators
It does, but your accusations were baseless.
4) armorgames decide moderation-issues w/o even looking at the case
The moderators deal with each issue at their own discretion. In case of a miscarriage of justice, a complaint may be made.
5) armorgames allows the accused moderators to moderate their own case, what is unaccaptable in any system
Freakenstein and Ferret also examined the case.
6) armorgames flat out lies here: "You chose to start and maintain a discussion with a religious topic that had absolutely nothing to do with the game in question. "
I was the one who reported this one. You weren't the only guilty party, but you certainly were one of the major ones. Game comment sections are not the place for religious debate. We have the WEPR for that. Even if that comment chain had been in there, it would likely have been removed and the posters warned for inappropriate behavior. MrDayCee left comments on all of the profiles of the users involved. I checked.
9) armorgames allows moderators to TROLL USERS.
A bit of mild mockery was in order given the massive flame war you attempted to start.
@twillight2 ; a few typographical errors in your post. Allow me to correct that.
We learn
1) armorgames allows its moderators to ban users w/o [stating the] reason [in a way that I can understand or allow myself to believe]
2) armorgames does not allow users to contest bans [in the particular fashion I have chosen to contest them] 3) armorgames does not allow [me] to present problems [that only I can see] with moderators [in the particular fashion I have chosen to present them]
4) armorgames decide moderation-issues w/o [me] even looking at the case [from an unbiased perspective]
5) armorgames allows the accused moderators to [state] their own case, [which] is [required of] any [effective judicial] system
6) armorgames [sees through my] flat out lies [and clearly explains the justification of their actions] here: "You chose to start and maintain a discussion with a religious topic that had absolutely nothing to do with the game in question. " - as the [unrelated] thread [that I am complaining about] was not a game's thread, but a general thread - it wasn't I who started the [aforementioned unrelated] thread
7) armorgames [makes valid and easily demonstrable statements such as] this: "All participants in this discussion were warned. All of them." - as only my posts were removed, and on top of it I was banned, while the other side ([who I invariably assume to be] Moegreche) suffered no action, this is nothing but flat out [justice]. 8) armorgames [sees through my] flat out lies again with this: "One of the images you linked to was me doing just that." - when the "apology" contains [various things that are not contained within the aforementioned apology], it is not an apology. This is an example of Ferret's [sound reasoning and unparalleled politeness], and "investigation of cases": "Moegreche has long been a Mod here at Armor Games, and is most upstanding of character. I'll let him respond to this if he wants to, but as far as I'm concerned the Armor Games admins support his ruling in this matter. If this thread derails itself into harassing/bashing a Moderator, I will personally obliterate your account. " So as Moegreche "has been ... most upstanding of character" there is no need [for me] to even look at the [facts, as I can just assume that everyone is corrupt and unjust, rather than considering my own behaviour]. [Yes,] it works that way. Upstanding President Nixon, eh? "has long been a Mod here at Armor Games, and is most upstanding of character. I'll let him respond to this if he wants to, but as far as I'm concerned the Armor Games admins support his ruling in this matter. "If this thread derails itself into harassing/bashing a Moderator, I will personally obliterate your account. " - what else is this other than [the pinnacle of tolerance and lenience toward a user who clearly has no justification for his extremely disruptive antisocial behaviour]?
9) armorgames allows moderators to [ban those who are verified] TROLL-USERS. The thread was renamed to "Moegreche MUST BE TIRED", [which] is nothing else but [a mildly humerous play on words]. And you figured out, it was [the administrator,] Ferret.
I have [many more hostile and blatanty erroneous things] to say. The case is obvious. Armorgames has very serious problems with [users like me, who make bombastic hatefull bigoted remarks, falsely accuse] moderators, [attempt to overrule] moderations, [and repeatedly violate the] terms&conditions, and in general [exhibits sound and proficient] public handling [by banning these users].
I know we want to show him the error of his ways and/or express what we think of him, but that's maybe taking it a bit far @FishPreferred Although I did laugh.
I know we want to show him the error of his ways and/or express what we think of him, but that's maybe taking it a bit far @FishPreferred Although I did laugh.
At this point, he's bashing not only Moe, but the entire AG staff and moderation team, so this may well be my last opportunity to instill a bit of introspective wisdom in him.
I am now faced with a difficult choice:
A) Act maturely and just watch what happens next, and emerge with my dignity intact. ಠ_ృ
B) Go for broke and write precisely what I think, risking the wrath of the mods.
@09philj , I'd say act mature. I won't say anything else about the matter, I am done trying to reason with twillight (apparently everyone is). Don't risk the wrath of the mods. You did well when you reported that game comment chain on the unrelated to the game religious discussion, but it isn't worth it. twillight won't listen, and all of us probably know what you are thinking. So while expressing it may seem like blowing off some steam, it isn't worth it.
Same goes for you @FishPreferred . Though you once again show your amazing ability to play with words as well as post precisely what you think in as few words as possible, we both know twillight won't listen. He's been warned, banned, warned, his first thread locked, and now he made a second. While I most certainly disagree with his behavior, it isn't worth it. Only for blowing some steam...
Reading through your post, I can react fairly simple to your statements and accusations @twillight2:
1) I, MrDayCee, was the one who banned you, NOT@Moegreche, ok?! The only reason he addressed you on your profile was because he replied to the debating thread that had a missunderstanding in it and he wanted to clear the air on that;
2) We Mods each have our own way of handling things, but whenever a situation occurs that is not clear or has us doubting on what to do, we always first put it up for discussion with fellow Mods and/or Admins before acting upon it;
3) You say we don't have evidence on the initial reason for banning you, but I can tell you, we still do... we chose to not post this is public and spare you the embarrassment. The evidence also includes to show that you started the religious discussion, everyone else being fairly decent in the discussion where you were the one flaming, trolling and swearing and you were the one that was ultimately at fault, not the other users. For this discussion held in the wrong place (game comments) everyone was warned, everyone. The reason you were banned was simple as stated above: flaming, trolling and swearing...
4) The reason the previous thread was locked was simple (once again...), you refused to listen to our arguments and chose your own to be fact, as in the whole truth, which lead us to believe there was no point in keeping it open any longer.
The attempted funny title change was a mixture of both fact and fun, seeing as we Mods are all still humans too after all...
5) The way you are reacting on this matter is way out of proportion. We warned you to read everything through and let it sink in first, but apparently you choose to pick up arms again and light the fire once more. I can notify you that we are currently discussing your case even more seriously as to what consequences this may have, because you refuse to listen to the discussion we want to have with you and instead, keep bashing on the team and one member in particular, who even has nothing to do with the core matter here.
Be wise in how you are going to pursue this matter from here on...
It makes me a little sad that you guys feel like you have to hold your tongue on certain matters. There's no 'wrath of the mods' - at least as far as I'm aware. I, for one, value and appreciate feedback on what I'm doing. And I'm sure if there are issues that make you guys unhappy, all of us mods would like to know. You're certainly not going to get banned for speaking your mind - even if it comes down to mod-bashing (as evinced by twillight's 2 threads to that effect without any repercussion).
So I would welcome any concerns or suggestions you guys have. Remember, we are here to make AG a more enjoyable place. So if there's something that we can change or fix that would make it more enjoyable, we would definitely like to know.
The one thing I would suggest not talking about is twillight's ban. He seems to be deeply confused as to why he got banned in the first place. In other words, he seems to think it has to do with his behaviour in a WEPR thread, which it doesn't at all.
So, yeah, if you guys want - we can turn this thread into something productive and useful. I think enough has already been said on the OP's statement. So if you have thoughts on how we might be better moderators, I, for one, would be happy to hear those thoughts.
To be fair to how you guys moderate the site, I for one can say it would be almost robotic to improve any further. What I mean is, you mods really don't need to improve on much. We're watching were saying (mostly my opinion) because we don't want to come off the wrong way to you guys, that's all. So to conclude, it wasn't any mods fault, it's a job. You guys are doing it well! There's your feedback.
It makes me a little sad that you guys feel like you have to hold your tongue on certain matters. There's no 'wrath of the mods'
What I was going to say was a rather blunt and not entirely pleasant assessment of the accusations of the OP, the character of the OP, and where the OP could stick his opinions, which I don't think you would look favorably upon.
The one thing I would suggest not talking about is twillight's ban. He seems to be deeply confused as to why he got banned in the first place. In other words, he seems to think it has to do with his behaviour in a WEPR thread, which it doesn't at all.
Ah. That would explain why he's trying to deny it. Because what he did say in the comments of Awesome Conquest(?) is undeniably against the rules.
First off, I want to state that I did not see any of what happened nor have I gone to look around. Just a disclaimer that I was not involved in this in any way and am looking at this as a neutral party.
It seems to me that twillight2 was banned for posting comments on some game talking about religion which then blew up. Seeing how it was getting out of hand and really had nothing to do with the game the mods came in and gave a warning to everyone that was involved. twillight2 then said something nasty in response and the ban was issued because of that.
Assuming what I said above is correct I believe it was a fair ban. What I don't understand is why MrDayCee and the mods are choosing to not post the evidence. With the mod's and twillight2's permission I would ask that the evidence be posted here so that any user can look at them and make their own choice and post their thoughts. Otherwise, if twillight2 refuses then then we must assume that the ban was the correct choice. If the mods refuse then I believe we might have cause for concern.
In summary, from what I know right now it seems like the ban was warranted seeing how multiple higher ups agreed that the ban should be issued. I will make a fair judgement if I am shown the evidence against the user.
Now, twillight2, in life things happen to you that aren't fair and you don't like. Let's assume that you are correct and the mods are wrong for the rest of this post. While you would have cause to be angry and mad, the previous thread, and also this one, are still no way to act. It would be much better if you tried to calmly explain your side and the way you are seeing things to the mods so they understand where you are coming from. While that being said, you should also try to look at it from the mod's point of view to see why they are saying what they are saying. Blowing up and getting angry will never help anyone and just make people mad. Just a general life lesson.
Twilight have you been reading ANYTHING said to you in regards to this incident? All of your concerns have been answered and answered multiple times.
I get you're upset, but I dare say you aren't just in a fit of blind rage but are keeping yourself willfully ignorant in order to keep yourself believing you are in the right.
