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thepyro222
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thepyro222
2,150 posts
Peasant

I grew up atheist for 16 years. I had always kept an open mind towards religion, but never really felt a need to believe in it. My sister started going to a Wednesday night children's program at a church. Eventually, I was dragged into a Christmas Eve service. Scoffing, I reluctantly went, assuming that this was going to be a load of crap, but when I went, I felt something. Something that I've never felt before. I felt a sense of empowerment and a sense of calling. Jesus called upon my soul, just like he did with his disciples. he wanted me to follow him. Now, my life is being lived for Christ. He died on the cross for my sins, and the sins of everyone who believes in him. He was beaten, brutalized, struck with a whip 39 times, made to carry a cross up to the stage of his death. This I believe to be true, and I can never repay him for what he has done.
I still have my struggles with Christianity, but I've found this bit of information most useful. Religion is not comprehensible in the human mind, because we cannot comprehend the idea of a perfect and supreme being, a God, but we can believe it in our heart, and that's the idea of faith. Faith is, even though everything rides against me believing in Jesus, I still believe in him because I know that it's true in my heart. I invite my fellow Brothers and sisters of the LORD to talk about how Jesus has helped you in your life. No atheists and no insults please

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shift4101
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shift4101
196 posts
Peasant

Religion=Ignorance
Atheism=Reasonable Thinking
Praying=Wishful Thinking
Studying=Knowledge


And that is exactly why none of you are willing to convert.

Let no one deceive himself. If anyone among you seems to be wise in this age, let him become a fool so that he may become wise. For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God. For it is written, "he catches the wise in their on craftiness"; and again, "The Lord the thoughts of the wise, and they are futile." - 1 Corinthians 3:18-21

All of you seem to believe the bible holds no knowledge other than "Believe in God, and make others do the same."

It teaches that knowledge is greater than all material things.

Take my discipline and not silver, and knowledge rather than choice gold. - Proverbs 8:10

It teaches that good things will come to those who wait.

For evildoers will be cut off, But those who wait for the Lord, they will inherit the land. - Psalm 37:9

It tells you that a kingdom built on it's foundations will prosper.

Give me wisdom and knowledge, that I may lead this people, for who is able to govern this great people of yours? - 2 Chronicles 1:10
shift4101
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shift4101
196 posts
Peasant

1 Corinthians 3:20 is supposed to say

The Lord knows the thoughts of the wise, and they are futile.

Jefferysinspiration
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Jefferysinspiration
3,139 posts
Farmer

Shift, can you go to page 201 please and reply to my response to you.

shift4101
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shift4101
196 posts
Peasant

Look, I don't know what you believe. You just keep claiming things and they are really pissing me off. So before we argue some more, can you please go into, with great detail, what you believe?

Jefferysinspiration
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Jefferysinspiration
3,139 posts
Farmer

If you could not be so arrogant and read the post, you might actually get the jist of it.

Avorne
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Avorne
3,085 posts
Nomad

You keep saying that God is there for us as long as we look to find him. However, this would mean that we're actively searching to 'feel' God and would result in bias, we'd start to fool ourselves into thinking that we can 'feel' God. I want actual proof of His existence - you say that we're like those people that deny that man walked on the moon, we have objective and unbiased proof that man did indeed do that, I have yet to see any objective proof of God. All I get from you is 'open your heart to God and search for him' which relies entirely upon subjective feelings aaaaaand could easily come about as people desperately try to create an emotional comfort blanket which, if we're honest, is what people use religion for most.

Jefferysinspiration
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Jefferysinspiration
3,139 posts
Farmer

It is not fair to the rest of the Christians of the world for you to call yourself one. You have taken all the work out of loving God. You don't need to try and save others, you don't need to strive to not sin, you don't even need to communicate with others what the bible says. You just have to believe, and you will be rewarded. Its the ultimate lazy christian principle. You do practically nothing and still get eternal rewards.

How can you judge my entire life after reading only a few posts on the internet? I do nothing for the Christian mission?

So i don't volunteer three days and three nights a week at the homeless shelter, living out Lukes message of helping the outcasted?
So i don't teach a kids Summer group, spreading the word of God?
So i don't follow the ten commandments? Because from my knowledge, i've never stolen or murdered.
I do not repent my Sins to God? Oh wait i do.

ou don't need to try and save others, you don't need to strive to not sin, you don't even need to communicate with others what the bible says. You just have to believe, and you will be rewarded

Really? Want to try that one again?

And the bible is not speaking metaphorically. There wasn't even a word for metaphors when it was written. There is a thing as being too open minded.

Do you even attend church? Because priests, as the new disciples, preach parables as metaphors.

You obviously split your bank and put money on both tables

No, see i acknowledge science is in the world - that is concrete. So i know it plays a part in how our world runs.

Do not judge lest you be judged. For in the way you judge, you will be judged; and by your standard of measure, it will be measured to you.

You clearly don't know the Bible as well as you think you do.

Do not Judge :].


^ My reply to you on page 201.

My beliefs - I believe that the Bible documents things relating to God. It also gives us an insight into history and society of the time. I believe God's authority was given to the world though Jesus who then passed this authority to the Apostles. We find God's authority through the Pope, Bishops, Priests. & Of course the Bible. I believe in "One, holy Catholic and apostolic church." i believe God created this world. I believe (obviously) in Jesus, morality, the sacraments, sin and the virgin Mary.
HahiHa
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HahiHa
8,256 posts
Regent

Just once wouldn't you love for someone to simply show you the evidence for God's existence? No arm-twisting. No statements of, "You just have to believe."

Thanks, but since it is about faith, it has to come from himself, or else I can't trust it; like you said, many things can be rationally explained. I can't possibly believe with a transmitter in between can I? God is supposed to be omnipresent, if he doesn't make a step actively I still should feel his presence. Well I don't.

Before you look at the facts surrounding God's existence, ask yourself, If God does exist, would I want to know him?

Why yes, certainly.. may I add that I didn't care for any facts when I tried to call on him, in fact I believe it only is supposed to work when you set all facts apart.

1. Everything that is mentioned under '1' is not an argument for design. It hasn't been made to suit us, we are the ones who survived the conditions leading us to where we are now. Look at it from the other way round, and the design argument looks silly.

May I add that instead, if it was design it would be pretty unintelligent design? Just to name one big fail: our brain and heart lacks of functional anastomoses, linkings between bigger blood vessels; pretty much the rest of the body has some. They assure that if one vessel is blocked, the blood can still circulate and go to every cell. Since we don't have them in the heart or the brain, we are ridiculously prone to infarcts and apoplexy.

2.
The universe has not always existed. It had a start...what caused that? Scientists have no explanation for the sudden explosion of light and matter.

We can assume there was alreday something before the big bang, but that the universe like we know it now has it's brth in the big bang (which, btw, is not an explosion but an expansion.)

The points under 3. ... basically what they are saying is, "We don't have a clue, therefore god did it." That's ridiculous. Everything influences everything, particles interact which is how the universe works. We haven't found out every single details up to now, doesn't mean we won't sometime. The fact we don't know something simply means we haven't found out by now, doesn't mean there is no reason behind it.
Not convincing.

4.
.. is a fail. We understand how that works actually. Plus, it's not like there was *poof* an organism with DNA in each cell. The very presence of DNA in each cell, it's information storage and it's capability of duplication is the reason why there are multicellular organisms. I beg you to read something about abiogenesis and about genetics.

5. Well, that's his personal interpretation. I simply want to find out how the world works, if there was a god I'd be glad to be enlightened and shown the truth, but during his absence I find the results of science very convincing, the way how it combines the facts is logic. I don't specifically want to convince believers of god's nonexistence, but I show them facts when they are wrong.
It's basically called education, and we don't need to plant a god behind all of this for it to make sense. In my opinion of course.

6.
So the narcissists are right and the objective people are not? That's not a real argument sorry. Also, scriptures don't have to be right. I don't care for what jesus might have done 2000 years ago; I just want to know if he exists now, if he cares now. Old stories are old^^

All in all, this guy has been trying to prove religion by logical thinking, which, sorry to say, doesn't work. Religion is about faith, blind faith, and creationism is the biggest joke in existence.

But hey, thanks for the read, I know it isn't your arguments and it was entertaining to read all of those.. again.

I just don't see what this has to do with my case?
shift4101
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shift4101
196 posts
Peasant

You keep saying that God is there for us as long as we look to find him. However, this would mean that we're actively searching to 'feel' God and would result in bias, we'd start to fool ourselves into thinking that we can 'feel' God. I want actual proof of His existence - you say that we're like those people that deny that man walked on the moon, we have objective and unbiased proof that man did indeed do that, I have yet to see any objective proof of God. All I get from you is 'open your heart to God and search for him' which relies entirely upon subjective feelings aaaaaand could easily come about as people desperately try to create an emotional comfort blanket which, if we're honest, is what people use religion for most.


Why do you deserve proof? What makes you such a special sinner that you deserve to take the faith part out of christianity. There is no proof. And there is nothing that can completely deny he exists. You are given such a simple task, to love Jesus and accept him, and yet you are too blinded to see the way. How crippled you must appear in my eyes.

Discard what you know, and look around you at the world. Do you believe that it solemnly evolved from species to species? Do you not keep love stored in your own heart?


And to Jefferysinspiration, I have read the post, and can only understand that you do tear up the Bible to assure yourself you won't truly die after death, but leave everything else up to the works of Man. And for that, I might as well repost my rebuttal against you.
Jefferysinspiration
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Jefferysinspiration
3,139 posts
Farmer

can only understand that you do tear up the Bible to assure yourself you won't truly die after death, but leave everything else up to the works of Man.


And how exactly do you work that out?
pballaddict
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pballaddict
128 posts
Nomad

To HahiHa, it's simply to make you think. My purpose was not to entertain you. And i agree with shift, be more open minded

HahiHa
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HahiHa
8,256 posts
Regent

You are given such a simple task, to love Jesus and accept him, and yet you are too blinded to see the way. How crippled you must appear in my eyes.

Get off your high horses and listen... you ask to love and accept something we can't know if it exists? When at the same time science is making so much sense? We don't need amterial proof, we just want that someone opens the door when we knock. Even the bible asserts that those who search, will find. Is it our fault if we search and find nothing? Is it our fault if we walk around with opened eyes, showing interest in what you call god's creation, instead of walking straight forward with closed eyes, disdaining the world we have accordingly been put into?
Jefferysinspiration
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Jefferysinspiration
3,139 posts
Farmer

can only understand that you do tear up the Bible to assure yourself you won't truly die after death, but leave everything else up to the works of Man


I've just realised you obviously didn't listen to the bible passage:
Do not judge lest you be judged. For in the way you judge, you will be judged; and by your standard of measure, it will be measured to you.
that i quoted for you.

What's this?
You choosing not to listen to things from the bible?
Doing exactly what you're accusing me of doing?
Avorne
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Avorne
3,085 posts
Nomad

Why do you deserve proof? What makes you such a special sinner that you deserve to take the faith part out of christianity.


Well, I assumed that the God you were talking about is a loving one, I thought that He might not want his creations suffering for all eternity and stuff but -shrugs- I guess I was wrong.

There is no proof. And there is nothing that can completely deny he exists.


The same could be said of Santa Claus, the Tooth Fairy and Hobbits. As well as that, the same could be said of the God and Gods of every other religion, what makes you so sure that you're on the right path?

You are given such a simple task, to love Jesus and accept him,

Would you say the same if, en masse, people suddenly starting worshipping the Great God Om? Now, there's no proof of Om and you really don't think He exists, everyone else says he does and that you have to accept Him though or you'll be punished for eternity.

yet you are too blinded to see the way. How crippled you must appear in my eyes.

Yet, in my eyes, you are the one that is crippled. You appear to be a brainwashed and vapid husk of a person, spewing out religious dogma and insane ramblings as your brain slowly shrivels away, you are blinded by faith and cannot see fact.
shift4101
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shift4101
196 posts
Peasant

To HahiHa, it's simply to make you think. My purpose was not to entertain you. And i agree with shift, be more open minded


Lets not put words into my mouth. Everyone today thinks they need to experience it all before they can decide which religion is right. But if you read Genesis carefully, we were never given the ability to decide what is right.

For God knows that in the day you eat of it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil." - Genesis 3:5

To Jefferysinspiration, you just claimed to believe in what science offers you. And also chose to believe in portions of the Bible. Is that not like the metaphor I used earlier? Putting your money on both tables so neither side can ridicule you?
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