I grew up atheist for 16 years. I had always kept an open mind towards religion, but never really felt a need to believe in it. My sister started going to a Wednesday night children's program at a church. Eventually, I was dragged into a Christmas Eve service. Scoffing, I reluctantly went, assuming that this was going to be a load of crap, but when I went, I felt something. Something that I've never felt before. I felt a sense of empowerment and a sense of calling. Jesus called upon my soul, just like he did with his disciples. he wanted me to follow him. Now, my life is being lived for Christ. He died on the cross for my sins, and the sins of everyone who believes in him. He was beaten, brutalized, struck with a whip 39 times, made to carry a cross up to the stage of his death. This I believe to be true, and I can never repay him for what he has done. I still have my struggles with Christianity, but I've found this bit of information most useful. Religion is not comprehensible in the human mind, because we cannot comprehend the idea of a perfect and supreme being, a God, but we can believe it in our heart, and that's the idea of faith. Faith is, even though everything rides against me believing in Jesus, I still believe in him because I know that it's true in my heart. I invite my fellow Brothers and sisters of the LORD to talk about how Jesus has helped you in your life. No atheists and no insults please
God created us in his image, to choose right or wrong.
This is a little beating around the bush. I'm still not sure whether or not you think God is perfect. Sorry Mage, I'm going to steal your quote to better prove my point:
"If God created us perfect, how could we have possibly sinned? If God intended to create us perfectly, but failed, how is he perfect? If God intended to create us imperfectly, how is it our fault for sinning?"-skembree
Which of these three scenarios is an accurate depiction of the god you believe in? Did God create us perfect and somehow we weren't perfect enough to avoid sinning? Did God fail to create us perfectly even though he wanted to, making him imperfect? Or did God intend to make us flawed, and therefore know that we would sin before we were aware of our consciousness?
He didn't intend to make us flawed or perfect. He made us to have free will. Whether that meant to be perfect or flawed. Adam and Eve started it all. And it didn't have to be them. It could have been another 1,000 years later.
He didn't intend to make us flawed or perfect. He made us to have free will. Whether that meant to be perfect or flawed. Adam and Eve started it all. And it didn't have to be them. It could have been another 1,000 years later.
How did God intend to make us then? And did his intention fail?
BigPO8 - awnser this directly, is having free will imperfect? Not the consequences, just free will alone.
Without the consequences, no, having free will is not imperfect. But the consequences are a part of free will, so with negative consequences possible to follow, free will is imperfect because it allows us to be incorrect. If we are incorrect, we are not perfect. The point I'm trying to stress is that if God gave us free will but knows every choice we're going to make, then it isn't really free will. It's more like the illusion of free will in our minds. If God doesn't know every choice we're going to make, then he isn't 100% perfect.
BigPO8 - awnser this directly, is having free will imperfect? Not the consequences, just free will alone.
Isn't it possible to have the potion to make a bad choice but not? If so then it's possible to have free will and be perfect as a being having the potion to make a bad choice but never doing it.
God won't stop you if you decide to go and hate on the local preacher or mock his name. This is called free will.
That isn't the point I was making. God knew that I would go hate on the local preacher before I did it if he is perfect, because he knows everything. Then he judges me based on the action that my brain was wired to do because he knew me fully in my mother's womb, better than I will ever know myself. How is it true free will if it doesn't escape God's knowledge of events? And if it does escape God's knowledge of events, then how is he perfect?
As you said, Freewill is not imperfect, so therefore God had to give us freewill to be perfect.
I said free will with consequences is imperfect. I never said that a lack of free will was imperfect. Since free will consists of consistently negative consequences of which the perfect God knew ahead of time, free will is not perfect. If free will did not consist of those consequences, then it could be perfect. That was what I was trying to say, but maybe I explained it poorly. The equation 2+2=4 is perfect because it is the truth, and it will always be this. There is no free will within the equation.
He didn't intend to make us flawed or perfect. He made us to have free will. Whether that meant to be perfect or flawed. Adam and Eve started it all.
Okay so why did god put a knowledge tree in the garden? It's like putting a deadly trap right beside a baby and tell the baby not to touch it. And why did god continue with the human race even after the mistake the humans did? He could of just pressed the reset button. Or is your god that sadistic?
