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thepyro222
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thepyro222
2,150 posts
Peasant

I grew up atheist for 16 years. I had always kept an open mind towards religion, but never really felt a need to believe in it. My sister started going to a Wednesday night children's program at a church. Eventually, I was dragged into a Christmas Eve service. Scoffing, I reluctantly went, assuming that this was going to be a load of crap, but when I went, I felt something. Something that I've never felt before. I felt a sense of empowerment and a sense of calling. Jesus called upon my soul, just like he did with his disciples. he wanted me to follow him. Now, my life is being lived for Christ. He died on the cross for my sins, and the sins of everyone who believes in him. He was beaten, brutalized, struck with a whip 39 times, made to carry a cross up to the stage of his death. This I believe to be true, and I can never repay him for what he has done.
I still have my struggles with Christianity, but I've found this bit of information most useful. Religion is not comprehensible in the human mind, because we cannot comprehend the idea of a perfect and supreme being, a God, but we can believe it in our heart, and that's the idea of faith. Faith is, even though everything rides against me believing in Jesus, I still believe in him because I know that it's true in my heart. I invite my fellow Brothers and sisters of the LORD to talk about how Jesus has helped you in your life. No atheists and no insults please

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314d1
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314d1
3,817 posts
Nomad

You will die after you deny your last chance to come to his glory. It won't be instant, It may be 10, 20, or even 80 years from that time, but the only reason you are still alive is to be brought back to the light.


Sooooo....I was once a Christian. By this logic, shouldn't your god have killed me while I was still a foolish child in order to "save" me?
Zydrate
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Zydrate
383 posts
Farmer

The universe is explained by science.
Are all scientists actively bull****ting you?
Prove it.


Religion tries to prove itself right by proving everyone else wrong.
Science tries to prove itself right by proving itself wrong.

The first option doesn't work.
MageGrayWolf
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MageGrayWolf
9,462 posts
Farmer

The universe is explained by science.
Are all scientists actively bull****ting you?
Prove it.


Part of science is to show your work, just like how in math class the teacher wants to to write out how you got the number you arrived at. This way anyone can look at the findings and come tot he same conclusion if they know how to follow it. So the proof that all scientists aren't actively bull****ting us is the objective evidence and repeatability of the findings. Something we keep asking for from religion but only get lame excuses back.
nonconformist
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nonconformist
1,101 posts
Nomad

If I heard a voice in my head suddenly go, "Hey, i'm God, tommorow *insert very unlikely thing* is going to happen to you, there's your proof i'm real" then i'd be MUCH more inclined to believe in him once said thing occurs that next day.

sooo if this did happen, and you told people what happened... It still leaves everything in the same boat because people are arrogant, ignorant, and need facts. But if it just happens to you its not fact, simply it could mean you were going insane. Which is what every athiest would say if you were to tell them... Because I can tell you right now that God told me it was going to rain between 9 and 10... stop and then start again at 1... And then you'll find every possible way to prove that i was lying, or false... So it wouldn't matter... As for this whole thing.. If God exists (im not saying he does i dont want every athiest here to start nazi quoting me here on this) and he has talked to people before, it would be exactly as it is now... You disproving them because its one against the world... of athiests... And guess what bud, none of us cares if you believe in God. Sorry to break your heart.

BigP08
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BigP08
1,455 posts
Shepherd

For the last time, we are not predestined for hell.

You're killing me with the links, bud. If you were making claims about science, or about what the Bible literally says, then a link is fine. But if you really think the things that are said in these links, just summarize them.

You aren't addressing me question. Again, all you're saying is "No, we're not predestined for Hell." I give you the steps to prove that we are predestined for Hell. You repeat, "No, we're no predestined for Hell." The most important question is WHY.

By this reasoning, when you say, "We do have free will." I could just say, "No, we don't." and it would be a valid response. Please ADDRESS where my chain is flawed. I'll give it to you again.
God is perfect. He knows everything that will happen and nothing happens that doesn't go according to his will. Because he creates our minds to react to the evironment in which he put us, he knows how we will respond. This means that God knows that we are going to Hell before we are born. It doesn't matter if we are capable of making choices because God created us beforehand knowing what choices we were going to make. If he simply changed our minds to make the right choices, or changed our environment to influence our minds differently, then he would be saving us.
God predestines us for Hell because he fails to do this.

Don't simply assert that I am wrong because we have free will within the confines of our own ability. That is irrelevant BECAUSE we don't have free will within the confines of God's pre-knowledge and existence outside of time and space.
Sssssnnaakke
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Sssssnnaakke
1,036 posts
Scribe

A man collects all animals in pairs in the world. A 100 YEAR FLOOD happens (which there is no evidence for. Do you really believe it?
Adam and Eve have children then what? That's right incest... which I believe is a sin? Also what the **** is up with a snake doing in the Garden if sin supposedly doesn't excist? Moses splits the sea (Again where is the evidence?) And supposedly they killed all Eygptians then why did a city survive later in the Bible? O.o
Weird things that people don't think about too much: Wine represents blood and a piece of bread is supposed to represent body... Disgusting! how can we still practice human sacrifice? Why?

shift4101
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shift4101
196 posts
Peasant

Sooooo....I was once a Christian. By this logic, shouldn't your god have killed me while I was still a foolish child in order to "save" me?


Can Christians who remove faith from their lives once again become Christian? Can a found sheep once again become lost?
Sssssnnaakke
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Sssssnnaakke
1,036 posts
Scribe

^ ignored my post (What else is to be expected of a arrogant christian)
Can a found sheep once again become lost?
From a herd infested with Aids?

shift4101
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shift4101
196 posts
Peasant

Bible literally says


Because God desires for everyone to spend eternity with him. He would not create a system where everyone won't have that opportunity.

This is good, and pleases God our Savior, 4 who wants all people to be saved and to come to a knowledge of the truth. - 1st Timothy 2:3-4

In the beginning, God gave a command. God knew that if they followed the command, they would never perish. But he also knew what as in store for them if they did not follow his command:

But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die. Genesis 2:17

God gives us free will. It is his will to let us all enter the Kingdom of heaven, but by our free will we deny ourselves that right.

Then someone has said (Not exact Quote)

Then why does God give us free will? Why doesn't he make us Obey?


Because then:

A: We would not be in his image.
B: There would be no reason for us to exist
C: We can surrender our free will, by having faith in him and doing his works.

God has written everyone's name in the book of life.
He foreordained everyone to go to heaven.

When you exercise your free will against him, your name becomes blotted out, and on the day of Judgement you are sent to hell forever.

This means that at the appointed time, God can say that he has know for all eternity just who would rebel and who would submit to his authority. But it made no difference to anyone because only he knew who was in that book and who was blotted out. No one knew other than this fair and just God.

Yet, knowing all this, this God of fairness and justice did not treat anyone unfairly. The Book of Life, written long before any life was ever created, will exonerate God from any and all charges of unfairness that Lucifer and unsaved mankind would have raised against him. If anyone should doubt this, then all they need to do is look at the record in the "other books", those books that have been recording every single thing that we have done during our life.

You saw me before I was born. Every day of my life was recorded in your books. Every moment was laid out before a single day had passed."


From a herd infested with Aids?


What does AIDS have to do with eternal, bodyless life?
shift4101
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shift4101
196 posts
Peasant

My second to last quote is from Psalms 139:16

100 YEAR FLOOD


40 days, bro.

Weird things that people don't think about too much: Wine represents blood and a piece of bread is supposed to represent body


Its weird how some people claim to know the bible says, and then show their ignorance.

^ ignored my post (What else can be expected from an arrogant christian)


I did not ignore your post. I wrote my post before your post was entered, and then pressed submit after you posted yours.

But your post is arrogant. They did not kill all the Egyptians. In fact, they ran away. And if anything ever split the sea, even science itself could not tell you if it happened. God created the Angels before he created the Earth. The devil is a fallen Angel. The gene pool during the times of Adam and Eve were strong. That means when incest occurred, they would have normal children. Nowadays, if it does occur, the babies are more than likely going to have mental and physical defects.
BigP08
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BigP08
1,455 posts
Shepherd

A: We would not be in his image.

Why did we have to be in his image?
B: There would be no reason for us to exist

I'm sure the people being tortured forever in Hell for a finite crime (if you can even call not knowing God exists a crime) feel that there is no reason that they exist.
C: We can surrender our free will, by having faith in him and doing his works.

So we have free will but if we don't do exactly what God says he will torture us forever? Do you really not understand that this isn't a type of free will worth having?
shift4101
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shift4101
196 posts
Peasant

So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them. Genesis 1:27

God created us for his glory. He will receive the ones that will and have brought it to him, and cast the ones out of his sight.

It is made clear that we cannot do exactly what God tells us. We must simply believe in him.

BigP08
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BigP08
1,455 posts
Shepherd

So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them. Genesis 1:27

If this is responding to me, you didn't answer my question. I didn't ask "Where in the Bible does it say God created us in his image?" I asked "WHY did God create us in his image?" The reason I ask it because you used God creating us in his image as a reason for having God's twisted version of free-will.
Why is this god depicted as being so arrogant and jealous? Why does he need us to worship him as the only way that he won't torture us forever?
shift4101
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shift4101
196 posts
Peasant

WHY did God create us in his image?


If we weren't, we would be like the animals in the field. God's image is intelligence, self-awareness, and sinlessness.

You either worship him and be eternally happy, or perish. Are you requesting a middle ground?
MageGrayWolf
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MageGrayWolf
9,462 posts
Farmer

sooo if this did happen, and you told people what happened... It still leaves everything in the same boat because people are arrogant, ignorant, and need facts. But if it just happens to you its not fact, simply it could mean you were going insane.


It's arrogant and ignorant to require facts? But your right, going insane or it simply being his imagination and a coincidence would have to somehow be ruled out.

Because I can tell you right now that God told me it was going to rain between 9 and 10... stop and then start again at 1... And then you'll find every possible way to prove that i was lying, or false... So it wouldn't matter... As for this whole thing.. If God exists (im not saying he does i dont want every athiest here to start nazi quoting me here on this) and he has talked to people before, it would be exactly as it is now... You disproving them because its one against the world... of athiests... And guess what bud, none of us cares if you believe in God. Sorry to break your heart.


This should of gives you a run down on how that works.

Seeing is believing. But seeing isnât knowing. Believing isnât knowing. Subjective convictions are meaningless in science, and eyewitness testimony is the least reliable form of evidence.

For example, if I go into my front yard and I see a large sauropod walking down the middle of my street, I will of course be quite convinced of what I see. I may be even more satisfied when I follow the thing and find that I can touch it, maybe even ride it if I want to. When I gather sense enough to run back for my camcorder, I may not be able to find the beast again, because I don't know which way it went. But that doesnât matter because I saw it, I heard it, felt it, smelt it and I remember all that clearly with a sober and rational mind. But somehow I'm the only one who ever noticed it, and of course no one believes me. Some other guy says he saw a dinosaur too, but his description was completely different, such that we canât both be talking about the same thing. So it doesn't matter how convinced I am that it really happened. It might not have. When days go by and there are still no tracks, no excrement, no destruction, no sign of the beast at all, no other witnesses whoâs testimony lends credence to mine, and no explanation for how a 20-meter long dinosaur could just disappear in the suburbs of a major metropolis, much less how it could have appeared there in the first place, -then it becomes much easier to explain how there could be only two witnesses who canât agree on what they think they saw, than it is to explain all the impossibilities against that dinosaur ever really being there. Positive claims require positive evidence. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, and thatâs what Iâd need â"since what I propose isnât just extraordinary; its impossible. But since there's not one fact I can show that anyone can measure or otherwise confirm, then my perspective is still subjective -and thus uncertain. Eventually, even I, the eyewitness, would have to admit that, although I did see it, I still donât know if it was ever really there â"regardless whether I still believe that it was.

source:
The 4th Foundational Falsehood of Creationism: belief = knowledge (Video)
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